Limitless: An AI Podcast

Ejaaz:
China has officially leapfrogged the US in AI models.

Ejaaz:
Qwen released two models, Qwen 3.6 Plus and 3.5 Omni, which have absolutely crushed

Ejaaz:
Claude Opus 4.6 and Google's Gemini.

Ejaaz:
Qwen 3.6 can basically do everything Claude Opus 4.6 can do, but two to three

Ejaaz:
times faster. It's also dramatically cheaper.

Ejaaz:
It's free. And it also is closed source, marking the first time that a Chinese

Ejaaz:
AI model is not open source. This is a signal that China may have finally beaten the U.S.

Ejaaz:
And we should be concerned about that. We're going to dig into that.

Ejaaz:
In other news, Open Air has also raised the largest private round ever,

Ejaaz:
$122 billion. We're going to get into all of this and more. But let's start with Qwen.

Josh:
I think I need to reel it in a little bit. I'm not sure Qwen is crushing the

Josh:
United States just yet. We still have frontier models.

Josh:
So, like, do not panic yet. But there are signs pointing towards a future in

Josh:
which China continues to gain pretty quickly on the U.S. So one of the most

Josh:
noteworthy things she mentioned is the fact that this model is closed source.

Ejaaz:
This is new.

Josh:
This is different. That we always said when we would discuss Chinese models

Josh:
that the biggest threat we'd know when they're getting close,

Josh:
when they start closed sourcing these models.

Josh:
And clearly they're getting close. They've closed sourced the model.

Josh:
Also, this model is available for free for a limited time, but totally available for free.

Josh:
And it's Opus 4.6 or close to 4.6 level intelligent, right? We're looking at these benchmarks here.

Josh:
It looks like it beats it in some things. It's a little less proficient in others.

Josh:
And again, these are the Chinese benchmarks, so we're not entirely sure how accurate this is.

Josh:
I suspect it is inaccurate. I suspect it's actually largely a distillation from

Josh:
Opus 4.6 and other frontier models.

Josh:
But yet the results do speak for itself and they are very impressive, right?

Josh:
Like particularly the speed in which they're able to generate high quality tokens.

Josh:
It's really, it's a pretty powerful model.

Ejaaz:
Yeah, so it's about three times faster than Opus and much faster versus Gemini.

Ejaaz:
It also has a 1 million context window, which now matches the American frontier models.

Ejaaz:
That's usually typically harder to pull off because it helps give your AI model

Ejaaz:
understanding and memory of what you're talking to it about.

Ejaaz:
And the reason why I would say the benchmarks are probably more accurate than

Ejaaz:
previous benchmark releases is they've been kind of honest about it.

Ejaaz:
So if you look on the left here, Terminal Bench 2.0, which is a regarded benchmark

Ejaaz:
for coding in particular, it surpasses and beats Opus 4.6.

Ejaaz:
But if you look at software engineering as a whole, they admit that Claude Opus

Ejaaz:
4.6 is still better than them.

Ejaaz:
So I don't know. I think this is a point.

Ejaaz:
This coupled with the fact that

Ejaaz:
they of closed source indicates that China might have the edge over here.

Ejaaz:
Now, for those of you who are confused why open source and closed source is

Ejaaz:
a signal that China is getting better,

Ejaaz:
The idea with Chinese AI models was they build an amazing model and they open

Ejaaz:
source it so that it decreases the value, price, and stock equity share of Frontier

Ejaaz:
American Labs, who are typically private and don't open source their models.

Ejaaz:
It also gives an opportunity for anyone and everyone to get access to Frontier

Ejaaz:
intelligence and build an amazing AI product.

Ejaaz:
The fact that they are closed sourcing it signals to me two

Ejaaz:
things one they've figured out a way to leapfrog

Ejaaz:
america maybe not on in this particular model but in

Ejaaz:
the next version model that they release and they don't want that proprietary

Ejaaz:
information going out and two i don't think they need to rely on american models

Ejaaz:
much in terms of copying the types of designs or research that they do so i

Ejaaz:
think they finally caught up it might be a hail mary it might be incorrect but

Ejaaz:
i think this is another deep seek moment

Josh:
Yeah, they're doing really well. And this is only one of two models that were

Josh:
released this week that were very impressive.

Josh:
The second one being Quen 3.5 Omni model, which does video audio vibe coating.

Josh:
So this is multimodal vibe. Can you explain to me what's happening here?

Ejaaz:
Okay, instead of explaining, let me just explain what's happening on the screen.

Ejaaz:
For those of you who are listening, I am staring at probably a drawing that

Ejaaz:
looks like a two-year-old's drawn it.

Ejaaz:
It's of a website, but it's just a bunch of boxes that someone has sketched out.

Ejaaz:
And it's a video of him explaining what each of the boxes should be.

Ejaaz:
He's saying, hey, there should be a video of someone explaining my product.

Ejaaz:
And then on the right here, this particular box should have some text explaining how my product works.

Ejaaz:
And then the box in the bottom left should be the pricing and allow people to

Ejaaz:
kind of purchase my product.

Ejaaz:
But literally, what we're looking

Ejaaz:
at right now is a marker pen with boxes around it. This does not exist.

Ejaaz:
This is on paper. This is a physical thing and now what you

Ejaaz:
see is him feeding this into this new model called quen 3.5 omni and it understands

Ejaaz:
everything he's saying it understands the vision that he has through his sketch

Ejaaz:
and it codes up a fresh website from scratch in seconds it's called audio visual

Ejaaz:
vibe coding and this is the first instance of this ever happening

Josh:
I will say, perhaps the models aren't always better, but the demos are always pretty strong.

Josh:
And I think the demos really carry a lot of weight when it comes to evaluating

Josh:
models, because if you are given a clear use case that a model is particularly

Josh:
good at like this, I mean, that's a really fun selling point and a really compelling selling point.

Josh:
There's one other demo from this model that I thought was pretty impressive, right?

Ejaaz:
Yeah. So it's an omni model, which means it's not just visual, but it's also audio.

Ejaaz:
It contains other types of mediums and in this particular demo an

Ejaaz:
issue that people have is they like to speak with their

Ejaaz:
ai model but sometimes when they're agreeing with the ai model or

Ejaaz:
they say something the model interrupts or thinks it's getting interrupted and

Ejaaz:
stops giving you the information that you want it becomes really annoying they've

Ejaaz:
developed this type of model where you can interrupt it and it knows when you're

Ejaaz:
actually trying to interrupt it and when it can just continue so i'll show you

Ejaaz:
a little clip over here could

Josh:
You give me a brief overview of this file please.

Ejaaz:
This document primarily discusses the Quen 3 series of models.

Ejaaz:
Its most prominent feature is the ability to autonomously decide whether to

Ejaaz:
respond quickly or engage in deep reasoning.

Ejaaz:
So there's a few things I want to point out here. Number one,

Ejaaz:
he's... You can't explain why this is important because that

Josh:
Seems so lame. It's like, obviously, it's not answering.

Ejaaz:
Okay, this is actually really cool. Okay, so there's a few things going on here.

Ejaaz:
Number one, he is scrolling through a research paper on his laptop and he's

Ejaaz:
holding his phone, which contains this model. and he's got the camera feed on.

Ejaaz:
So he's showing the pages that he's scrolling through.

Ejaaz:
This model is reading this entire paper as he scrolls through,

Ejaaz:
so much faster than a human can.

Ejaaz:
It's digesting and understanding what it's reading and then it's summarizing

Ejaaz:
all the key points to him.

Ejaaz:
But as he's listening to her speak about what it's seeing on the screen,

Ejaaz:
he's saying, oh, I see. Oh, that's interesting.

Ejaaz:
Now, typically when you have a human conversation with someone and you're making

Ejaaz:
those same comments, the human doesn't

Ejaaz:
stop talking and telling you the information that you want it to hear.

Ejaaz:
But this model is smart. It understands that he's not trying to interrupt it

Ejaaz:
and it just continues flowing and speaking smoothly, which I think is a breakthrough. It's super cool.

Josh:
Yeah, very impressive model. And this isn't the only news out of China.

Josh:
Also, there's another team.

Josh:
Okay, this team, I'm trying to figure out how to pronounce this.

Ejaaz:
Say the name, Josh.

Josh:
So it says Zipu, but I'm aware that it's not actually pronounced Zipu.

Ejaaz:
It is cheapo

Josh:
Jipu so jipu okay so yeah so china is now good enough at building models that

Josh:
we're learning their dialect because we have to reference it that frequently

Josh:
so that's probably a high signal if we're having chinese lessons on the show

Josh:
from ijaz then china's getting pretty good what makes um this new jipu released

Josh:
model uh so impressive here so.

Ejaaz:
Glm which is their flagship model has kind of been similar to quen in terms

Ejaaz:
of capabilities reasoning coding and when we looked at the Quen models just

Ejaaz:
now, we saw it go from a simple sketch,

Ejaaz:
a handwritten sketch, to a fully functioning web app, coded in real time in a couple of seconds.

Ejaaz:
And you might think, ah, that's just one AI lab. They just got lucky.

Ejaaz:
Who cares? We can crush them in the future.

Ejaaz:
What you're seeing on your screen right now is another entirely different AI

Ejaaz:
lab, which released their own model this week, and it does the exact same thing, sketch to code.

Ejaaz:
So the point is, whether these Chinese labs are working together or not,

Ejaaz:
whether they're training on the same hardware or they're not,

Ejaaz:
they're able to achieve the same frontier research and breakthroughs around

Ejaaz:
the same time, which is the reason why I think this isn't just a one-off.

Ejaaz:
I think China has collectively caught up with the US and are posing a significant threat.

Josh:
Yeah, it's very impressive what

Josh:
they're doing. And this comes off the back of a lot of drama, I guess.

Josh:
I was hearing rumors that some of the developers from Manus,

Josh:
the company that was acquired by Facebook, were not allowed to leave the country.

Josh:
And this is happening with a few other AI labs, I think Quen may be one of them,

Josh:
or DeepSeek, where the developers are kind of, they've become government assets,

Josh:
if you will, in a way that is a little unnerving, but progress is getting good.

Josh:
So it's at the point now where we're still ahead.

Josh:
I'm telling you right now, China does not have Capybara.

Ejaaz:
Because if they did,

Josh:
They'd probably be doing some serious damage. But they are making some serious progress.

Josh:
And also, another company making serious progress is our good pals at Google,

Josh:
who just as we started recording this release, Gemma 4.0.

Josh:
This is a purpose-built model for advanced reasoning and agentic workflows.

Josh:
On the hardware that you own, the thing that is optimized into Gemma is the

Josh:
model performance per bit.

Josh:
It's like, how much intelligence can you get per bit of information?

Josh:
And according to this chart it's very very high.

Ejaaz:
Yeah so um if we look at

Ejaaz:
this chart it's showing that um gemma 4 which

Ejaaz:
is the recent model is only a 30 it comes in two

Ejaaz:
versions a 31 billion parameter model and a 26 billion parameter model so that

Ejaaz:
is significantly small when you consider that capybara the the next anthropic

Ejaaz:
model that you just mentioned is probably in order of magnitude higher it's

Ejaaz:
five to ten trillion parameters so it's a much smaller model but it keeps up

Ejaaz:
with some of the bigger models,

Ejaaz:
specifically the Chinese AI models that we were just talking about.

Ejaaz:
So if you look on the right over here, we've got GLM-5, Kimi-K 2.5,

Ejaaz:
and Quen 3.5, which are each around 400 billion to a trillion parameters large.

Ejaaz:
So the amount of intelligence per square density is not the right term,

Ejaaz:
is really high with Gemma 4.

Ejaaz:
And it's cool to see American Labs releasing open source models.

Josh:
Yeah. So shout out to Google. We have another shout out this week for another

Josh:
American company that goes by the name of OpenAI, you may have heard of them, they just closed.

Josh:
The largest funding round in history. No one's ever raised more money than OpenAI

Josh:
just did at $122 billion in committed capital.

Josh:
It's important to note that this capital has not been inserted into a bank account.

Josh:
This is committed capital at an $852 billion post-money valuation.

Josh:
Now, there's some highlights here. Amazon is putting in $50 billion,

Josh:
which is ironic because OpenAI a open ai

Josh:
signed a 100 billion dollar aws deal nvidia is

Josh:
putting in 30 billion dollars which is ironic because open ai

Josh:
runs on nvidia gpus softbank is putting

Josh:
in 30 billion dollars which is ironic because they're building stargate together

Josh:
so there's a lot of this circular economic element to this um i mean 35 billion

Josh:
of amazon's investment is just contingent on open ai achieving AGI or going public.

Josh:
So this leads us to the natural conclusion. Well, this is this is their final

Josh:
hurrah before they go public.

Josh:
This is the last private round that we will ever see. This is the largest of

Josh:
all time before their blockbuster IPO sometime possibly later this year.

Ejaaz:
Yeah, exactly. And I don't know if the public is buying it.

Ejaaz:
Bloomberg released a report this week, which claims that OpenAI shares have

Ejaaz:
fallen out of favor on the secondary market.

Ejaaz:
And can you guess which company, Josh, it's fallen in favor of?

Josh:
Surely it's Anthropic.

Ejaaz:
Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding.

Josh:
The pretty cool new kid on the block.

Ejaaz:
Yeah, although Anthropic and the Claw team have had a nightmare in security

Ejaaz:
this week and done two very important leaks, the public doesn't care.

Ejaaz:
They still want all of that Anthropic shares and equity, and they're selling

Ejaaz:
or willing to sell OpenAI secondary shares in favor of this.

Ejaaz:
But there is still some cool news from the raise, Josh. Did you know

Ejaaz:
$3 billion of the $122 billion raised was available for individual investors,

Ejaaz:
not retail investors, but individual investors to invest in.

Ejaaz:
They were able to get exposure through their banks.

Ejaaz:
Now, I don't know which banks. I don't know what the vetting process was like.

Ejaaz:
But the fact is, OpenAI did not know who these individual investors were,

Ejaaz:
but they offered up $3 billion to allow retail to get access to.

Ejaaz:
But I think you needed to be an accredited investor. So it kind of sucked in that respect.

Ejaaz:
But they kind of threw the retail audience who didn't get access to the $3 billion

Ejaaz:
a bone by claiming in this latest fundraising round that ARK,

Ejaaz:
invest which has several etfs which give you exposure to private ai companies

Ejaaz:
they're going to add a bunch of open ai equity stock to that which i actually

Ejaaz:
don't think is a good bit of news given the vcx drama from last week

Josh:
Can we talk about that private fundraising around wait so who is available because

Josh:
i never heard of this yeah um i had no idea that it was even possible for money

Josh:
to be raised by individuals who are now on the cap table that's pretty cool

Josh:
i would have love to have participated in that.

Josh:
I think the ARK news here is interesting because the day that word came out

Josh:
that secondary shares are having a little bit of trouble being liquid,

Josh:
ARK decided to add those secondary shares into a public venture fund.

Josh:
Like, oh, we've had enough of this now. We're done with this toy.

Josh:
Now the public retail market can get access to it. And that's kind of what happened.

Josh:
Perhaps the timing is ironic, but it's certainly a bit coincidental that three

Josh:
of the new ARK Invest ETFs included these OpenAI shares on the back of the most

Josh:
recent fundraising round and the rumor that it is becoming increasingly difficult

Josh:
to offload these shares.

Josh:
So the market, I mean, I don't want to say it's getting frothy.

Josh:
It's just growing remarkably fast.

Josh:
And it is showing some signs of trouble, I guess, in paradise for to some extent.

Josh:
I mean, again, all of this is pretty warranted and justified,

Josh:
but it is important to note that these are our commitments.

Josh:
Again, like they did not close this money. These are commitments.

Josh:
And we've seen what happens when commitments happen.

Josh:
OpenAI has committed to buying a whole bunch of RAM that they're no longer buying.

Josh:
And the price of memory the last couple of weeks has not collapsed,

Josh:
but it has returned to...

Josh:
Very high levels instead of unfathomably high levels.

Josh:
So there is a lot of work that's being held in that commitment word.

Josh:
But nonetheless, congratulations to OpenAI, $122 billion. It's more than anyone's

Josh:
ever raised in history. And it's a really big deal.

Ejaaz:
A lot of the capital was raised from the likes of NVIDIA, Amazon,

Ejaaz:
and presumably all that money is going to go back to them in the form of compute.

Ejaaz:
OpenAI president Greg Brockman went on an interview, I think like yesterday

Ejaaz:
and basically said, we're focusing all our resources on compute.

Ejaaz:
Compute and scaling laws are definitely intact. And he says,

Ejaaz:
quote, if I could get my hands on all of the compute in the world and purchase

Ejaaz:
it, I would do it because it's become a positive revenue cost center.

Ejaaz:
So OpenAI thoroughly believes that more compute that they have equals to more revenue.

Ejaaz:
And that trend isn't going to break anytime soon. So we'll see if that pays

Ejaaz:
off. This is a pretty big bet.

Josh:
Foot on the gas, up only, man. I'm still bullish. I am still very bullish.

Josh:
I'm also bullish on Claude, which had a new update this week in terms of computer use, right?

Josh:
Now it's like pretty much capable of doing anything on your computer for you.

Josh:
This is OpenClaw, Claude edition, and it seems to be working pretty well.

Josh:
I was actually playing around with it.

Ejaaz:
It's really cool. It's good. It's good. Okay.

Ejaaz:
So it seems to be every single week, heck, every single day,

Ejaaz:
Anthropic has released a new feature and they've done that for the last,

Ejaaz:
I believe, 18 days, which is just an insane feat for any frontier startup or company alone.

Ejaaz:
But the point is, These features collectively together have automated a very

Ejaaz:
important thing, which is the entire software engineering role.

Ejaaz:
And I'm not dramatizing this.

Ejaaz:
Previously, we had Claude Code, the most popular Claude product,

Ejaaz:
arguably, earning billions of dollars for them every single month. But...

Ejaaz:
It just generated the code. You would then need to launch the app that it had

Ejaaz:
built, test the app out yourself.

Ejaaz:
You would need to run a bunch of tests, give feedback to Claude,

Ejaaz:
and it would still need or require a human in the loop.

Ejaaz:
This update, computer use, completely removes it from you.

Ejaaz:
And I actually summarized it in a tweet here where it basically says,

Ejaaz:
Claude writes the code for you.

Ejaaz:
Then it opens up the app that it coded. Then it clicks through the entire app

Ejaaz:
and finds the bugs that it itself created. does the security testing and everything,

Ejaaz:
then it fixes the bug and improves the app.

Ejaaz:
Now, if you consider the fact that Anthropic also released a remote control

Ejaaz:
feature where you can basically text code from your phone and you don't even

Ejaaz:
need to be anywhere near your terminal,

Ejaaz:
you start to see how you can just message it and come back a few hours later

Ejaaz:
to a fully fledged app that has been reiterated,

Ejaaz:
tested a bunch of times with real human feedback or agentic feedback.

Ejaaz:
And you just have a award-winning product in a couple of hours or maybe even

Ejaaz:
a couple of weeks. It's just insane.

Josh:
It's cool. The qualification of everything has been a prominent theme of everything

Josh:
that has been released over the last few weeks.

Josh:
And I mean, we have new news from Manus as well, where they just rolled out,

Josh:
remote phone control for your desktop.

Josh:
So if you are running an instance of Manus, you can just text your computer

Josh:
from the go on your smartphone and it will, again, take over your computer,

Josh:
do all the computer use things that you expect from a product like OpenClaw,

Josh:
except they're rolling it out themselves.

Josh:
So there's a lot of this qualification. I think it's great.

Josh:
This is like the transition into the operating system, AI first OS type progress.

Josh:
And it's really exciting to see.

Josh:
Now, on this agenda here, we have something that says Anthropic League 2. Is there another...

Josh:
Anthropic leak. But what else has happened? We've been talking about Anthropic leaks all week.

Ejaaz:
No, I just wanted to point out that like, it all looks really rosy with Anthropic,

Ejaaz:
but they've just come off like a nightmare of a week.

Ejaaz:
Two leaks in a week, the second one being the largest one that I'm showing on

Ejaaz:
screen, the entire source code of CloudCode is now or was openly available.

Ejaaz:
And I think it had by the end of the day, 90,000 forks, which means that it's

Ejaaz:
living on at least 90,000 devices, which is just insane to think about.

Ejaaz:
And if you want to understand how crazy this is and also the secret features

Ejaaz:
and products that they're about to release that were revealed in the code.

Ejaaz:
We created an entire episode about this. Definitely go check that out and watch

Ejaaz:
it. We reveal all the details there.

Ejaaz:
But the point being is Anthropic is kind of succeeding and winning in a lot

Ejaaz:
of different ways, but they might be running too fast for themselves.

Ejaaz:
They're building everything. I think 100% of the features that they build now is using Claude code.

Ejaaz:
So it might also leave them up to exposure and weaknesses such as this.

Josh:
I love it. move fast and break things man just get stuff

Josh:
out the door if it doesn't work you'll fix it in hindsight i mean

Josh:
sure this was a big l but then they automate this approval process

Josh:
i saw boris the person who created a cloud code he actually addressed

Josh:
this publicly on x and he said um it was a single person it

Josh:
was an honest mistake they've built in implementations for that to no longer

Josh:
happen again and they're just going to keep moving on and i really respect the

Josh:
velocity and the transparency that they've been doing as they just get all the

Josh:
stuff out the door velocity is such a big thing there's a company who has absolutely

Josh:
zero velocity perhaps even negative velocity that we're going to talk about

Josh:
next, which is Microsoft,

Josh:
who has launched a product using Claude.

Josh:
And when I first read this headline,

Josh:
I was a little confused because if my memory serves me correctly,

Josh:
Microsoft owns what, they're the largest single shareholder in OpenAI by an

Josh:
incredibly large margin, and 31%, and that gives them access exclusively to all of the OpenAI IP.

Josh:
They have internal access to all of the models. So please explain to me why

Josh:
Microsoft, aside from them not making anything valuable in the world of AI,

Josh:
why are they choosing to use Claude as their provider of choice instead of ChatGPT?

Ejaaz:
I have a simple answer for this. It may sound biased, probably because I am a little biased.

Ejaaz:
I think Claude is just better for certain use cases. I'm not going to say all

Ejaaz:
use cases, but for certain things.

Ejaaz:
This isn't the first product that they've launched that is powered by Claude.

Ejaaz:
There is one product that they released two weeks ago called Microsoft Cowork.

Ejaaz:
Does that name sound familiar to you, Josh?

Josh:
Yeah, I've used Cowork and Claude for the last couple of months, actually.

Ejaaz:
There you go. So they released an entire blog post talking about how they have

Ejaaz:
managed to automate a bunch of desktop tasks.

Ejaaz:
So basically, Microsoft's feature takes over your desktop and can do a bunch

Ejaaz:
of things like operating your browser, opening up files, a bunch of cool stuff like that.

Ejaaz:
And right at the end of the blog post, in tiny little print,

Ejaaz:
it said, oh, by the way, this is powered by Anthropics Cloud Cowork Model.

Ejaaz:
And now today or this week, they announced two new products.

Ejaaz:
It's called Microsoft Critique and Microsoft Council. It is a deep research

Ejaaz:
feature, which basically is now state-of-the-art in terms of research.

Ejaaz:
You can ask Microsoft's feature, critique or counsel, a question,

Ejaaz:
and it does a ton of research, really high quality, and the answers and outputs

Ejaaz:
are very, very impressive. You can get access to it via co-pilot.

Ejaaz:
But what's interesting is it's powered by two models, Claude and ChatGPT.

Ejaaz:
And the way that it works is arguably the most interesting part.

Ejaaz:
They spin up a bunch of instances of Claude and a bunch of instances of ChatGPT

Ejaaz:
and get them to talk to each other.

Ejaaz:
One produces the research, one reviews the research. By the end of the back

Ejaaz:
and forth process, you end up with an amazingly perfectly polished research article or paper.

Ejaaz:
And I actually think this is cool because it shows that running multiple instances

Ejaaz:
of AI models and agents are actually a better way to have a better product.

Josh:
You know, my favorite Microsoft news of the week, it just happened on the spaceship, the Artemis mission.

Josh:
They were live streaming the live comms and they're using Microsoft Outlook

Josh:
and all the instances crashed and they couldn't figure out how to get them to work or to open.

Josh:
And they were trying to remote into them and the software is falling apart.

Josh:
And I think that's a testament to kind of where Microsoft is right now in the world of AI.

Josh:
It's just clunky, very slow moving and very corporate, I guess would be a good way of describing them.

Josh:
Now, the next topic we're going to talk about, my BS meter is going crazy.

Josh:
I'm like, there's no way this is right.

Josh:
This seems like they're using a lot of big words. The two words that this company

Josh:
has shrunk together is electromagnetic super intelligence.

Josh:
Generally, when people speak like this,

Josh:
It's veiled in a lot of complexity that might not be true.

Josh:
Can you explain what on earth is going on with this electromagnetism story?

Ejaaz:
Yes. Okay. So this company, or startup rather, has come out of stealth claiming

Ejaaz:
to have built a new type of AI model. It is called an electromagnetic AI model.

Ejaaz:
And what it does is you can describe the type of electromagnetic behavior that

Ejaaz:
you want, and it will generate the physical shapes and structures,

Ejaaz:
a high-fidelity design that will produce those electromagnetic signals.

Ejaaz:
Now, you might be asking, who the hell cares? Why would I care about this particular model?

Ejaaz:
Well, if you are building antennas, if you are scaling 5G and 6G,

Ejaaz:
but most importantly, if you're designing AI chips in particular,

Ejaaz:
which requires microscopic attention to detail shapes that allow these transistors

Ejaaz:
to talk to each other, you need help in terms of an AI model describing that.

Ejaaz:
Now, previous models, they tested this with Claude Opus 4.6 and GPT 5.4,

Ejaaz:
can't get to the precise design because it doesn't actually understand how the

Ejaaz:
physics of these AI chips and transistors works.

Ejaaz:
Now, this company is claiming that their model does exactly that.

Ejaaz:
And they had a demo chip, which they portrayed in their video or opening announcement demo.

Ejaaz:
I don't know whether this chip works, but if it does, it might be able to automate

Ejaaz:
the most important and valuable company in the world right now,

Ejaaz:
NVIDIA, who spends all their money, NTSMC,

Ejaaz:
designing all these next-gen GPUs and chips and gives them a valuation of $4.5 trillion.

Josh:
Yeah, okay. So I guess it's one of those things where we'll see.

Josh:
Like I imagine all the Frontier Labs know that this exists.

Josh:
Reading the comments section, it appears as if this is not new research.

Josh:
They've just actually acted on it and are starting to test it.

Josh:
So one of the things that we will keep on the watch list of things to follow

Josh:
along and see how they progress.

Josh:
The next on our agenda list, and stick with us, we have three more topics to

Josh:
go, is Oracle apparently fired 30,000 employees. What's going on here?

Ejaaz:
It's exactly what it says. 30,000 employees, between 20 to 30,000 employees

Ejaaz:
received an email two days ago in the morning, basically saying,

Ejaaz:
sorry, you have been laid off.

Ejaaz:
Now, there's a bunch of speculation as to why this is happening.

Ejaaz:
Maybe something to do with the $300 billion partnership deal that they signed

Ejaaz:
with OpenAI and a bunch of other semiconductor companies.

Ejaaz:
Maybe it's something to do with that. Maybe they overstepped.

Ejaaz:
Maybe it's something to do with Stargate's Abilene data center getting shut

Ejaaz:
down because they weren't able to finance it.

Ejaaz:
Oracle and OpenAI were the main partners in that, along with SoftBank.

Ejaaz:
I don't know. How does this look to you, Josh? Is this a warning signal? Is the bubble popping?

Josh:
No. Every company is grossly overinflated in terms of how many employees it has.

Josh:
During COVID in particular, how many companies were hiring like 10,000,

Josh:
like tens of thousands of people per year? So many.

Josh:
And for no reason. And I think during that time when it became too okay to do

Josh:
remote work and to switch away from in-person stuff, it was just very easy to

Josh:
hire all these new people. Interest rates were zero. It was free money.

Josh:
You can just, why wouldn't we double our workforce and get more productivity?

Josh:
But now that the reality is setting in that they're really just,

Josh:
and this isn't even as a result of AI. It's just there's not a need for that

Josh:
amount of workforce in order to do these things.

Josh:
People are just getting laid off. And that's kind of what's happening here is

Josh:
there's just absolutely no need to keep hundreds of thousands of dollars on

Josh:
the payroll that aren't being super productive.

Josh:
We saw that with what company laid everyone off? Jack Dorsey Square.

Josh:
Yeah, Jack Dorsey Square.

Josh:
They laid off people. The stock went up 30%. 40% in one day.

Ejaaz:
Wait, wait, sorry. They laid off 40% of people, right? And then their stock went up 30%?

Josh:
I think the stock went up 40% too in the day. Like it was a crazy game.

Josh:
It was this unbelievable thing. And I think the market is starting to reward

Josh:
efficiency, right? It's like, it's obvious you don't need this bloated headcount.

Josh:
A lot of people are not working. They're just getting by on their laptop.

Josh:
A lot of them work remotely.

Josh:
This is just a testament of this recalibration that's happening.

Josh:
And I don't think you should really credit AI with too much of this because

Josh:
a lot of these effects started happening before AI was even good at writing code.

Josh:
Like AI just got good at writing code like three months ago.

Josh:
It hasn't been that long. And companies haven't even really implemented this

Josh:
in a meaningful way at scale. So I wouldn't worry too much about this.

Ejaaz:
Josh, can I pull up the Oracle chart for you? Just to prove your point.

Ejaaz:
I mean, it's nothing major, but it's up. It's up on the week.

Ejaaz:
And this is after like a month of downtrend. So the market's obviously rating that as positive.

Josh:
Nice good well that's a w um another possible w i don't know if this is a w

Josh:
or not is the meta glasses news you know i'm the biggest hater of these classes

Josh:
i'm actually i'm becoming the biggest meta hater ever okay because like meta

Josh:
why am i calling you meta when you just cancel your meta division um but we

Josh:
have new glasses news what's going on with these glasses okay.

Ejaaz:
Okay listen let's not hype this up too much it is uh an optically friendly pair

Ejaaz:
of their ai glasses So typically, if you had eyesight issues and you required

Ejaaz:
prescription glasses, you couldn't use this. Well, guess what, guys?

Ejaaz:
Now you can. But what excites me the most is some of the software updates which

Ejaaz:
are included in this, which involves nutrition tracking, Josh.

Ejaaz:
Now, you know me. I go to the gym quite a bit and I'm trying to figure out my

Ejaaz:
calories so I can lose a few pounds before the summer, okay?

Ejaaz:
Like, I'm just, I'm being honest.

Ejaaz:
These glasses supposedly can see the things that you're drinking,

Ejaaz:
that you're eating, that you're cooking and measure the amount of calories that

Ejaaz:
is in the portion of your bowl or that you're making and can tell you when you've

Ejaaz:
been eating too much or when you need to stop.

Ejaaz:
Now, I don't know if the tech is actually accurate. I remember that there was

Ejaaz:
a company which just got sold to, what's that fitness app, MyFitnessPal?

Ejaaz:
It got sold to them. It was a vibe-coded app that basically you can show a camera,

Ejaaz:
show your food in a camera, and it can basically estimate the calories.

Ejaaz:
It got sold for upwards of $10 billion, I believe, or something crazy like that.

Ejaaz:
It was acquired for like between two to ten billion dollars um this is a proving

Ejaaz:
point that maybe something like this could be cool in the future i don't know

Ejaaz:
if i want to wear meta glasses though to get this feature i would rather just use my phone

Josh:
I don't believe them i don't believe a word that they say i think the last time

Josh:
when they came out and they revealed these meta right band glasses they went

Josh:
on stage and they actually had to demo it in real time in front of everyone

Josh:
every single demo failed it was a nightmare and i just can't trust a company

Josh:
that continues to fail over and over at all these promises that they share.

Josh:
It's like our meta promise, our glasses promise, all these promises are just,

Josh:
unfulfilled. And where's AI? They've spent billions of dollars.

Josh:
There is none. So I'm remaining the biggest meta hater.

Josh:
I am a Zuckerberg lover. I hope he can figure it out. He's an incredible CEO and an operator.

Josh:
He's running a company that he founded and I'm so bullish on it.

Josh:
But man, I just, I will not be participating in these glasses.

Ejaaz:
Something is working. They said on their last quarterly earnings,

Ejaaz:
they're on track to sell 20 to 30 million units of these this year.

Ejaaz:
I don't know who the hell is buying that, but they have some kind of a market.

Ejaaz:
And I do believe that glasses will be one of, not the, but one of the main form

Ejaaz:
factors for AI. So we will see.

Ejaaz:
But on our last news story, Valor Atomics raised a crazy round. What's happening here?

Josh:
Yes, this is huge. If you made it this far in the episode, chances are you are

Josh:
a real one. You are an OG. You have been listening to the show.

Josh:
You love this show. And if you've been around for long enough,

Josh:
you were here when we interviewed the CEO of Valor Atomics, Isaiah Taylor.

Josh:
Since then, the valuation of Valor Atomics has gone up, I think, 27x.

Josh:
And it has come to a point in which they have just concluded their $450 million

Josh:
in fundraising at a $2 billion valuation.

Josh:
Valor Atomics, for those who are not familiar, create modular nuclear reactors.

Josh:
What you're seeing on screen is a little image of what this reactor looks like.

Josh:
And it's just this tiny little thing you could put next to a data center and

Josh:
power it using clean nuclear.

Josh:
Reusable nuclear energy in this very beautiful package

Josh:
they were the first private company ever to have a

Josh:
successful version of nuclear energy they actually used

Josh:
a radioactive isotope they generated energy from

Josh:
it and things seem to be going very well so for those

Josh:
of you who haven't seen that episode it is still timely it is still relevant

Josh:
with isaiah taylor you can find it linked in the description below but just

Josh:
a congratulations to the team at valor who are building some bad ass technology

Josh:
and getting rewarded for it and i think it's just a nice way to wrap up the

Josh:
week here is um with the big win for the people building the frontier of technology

Josh:
and what's possible would.

Ejaaz:
It have not been nice josh if we could have invested or even helped our audience

Ejaaz:
and our listeners invest back then 27x

Josh:
That's yeah it's pretty good yeah according to

Josh:
claude at least the uh the limitless portfolio of when guests

Josh:
have come on versus where they're at now has been pretty good we've

Josh:
we've hit every single one all of the companies have done incredibly well

Josh:
and um yeah it's just it's really exciting it's isaiah

Josh:
is a great dude really ambitious really smart really talented along

Josh:
with the entire rest of the team so a nice win to round up

Josh:
our week with and i think that concludes everything for the week we've covered

Josh:
a lot of ground this week there is so much stuff that happened

Josh:
as it always does right we are on the frontiers of

Josh:
the hottest industry in the world but if you've listened to all of the episodes

Josh:
if you made it this far through the end of our final episode you're caught up

Josh:
you can go touch grass this weekend you're done you could just like wipe your

Josh:
hands clean you know everything that's going on go share it with your friends

Josh:
share this episode with your friends if you enjoyed it and uh yeah thanks so

Josh:
much for joining us for another amazing week.

Ejaaz:
And I will just say, if you are listening to this and you are a startup founder

Ejaaz:
that is roughly valued between 10 to maybe $100 million and you're going on

Ejaaz:
to your next round, hey, maybe reach out to us. Maybe we'll platform you.

Ejaaz:
You see the effect that we have.

Ejaaz:
We're also looking for additional sponsors as well. So if this sounds like your

Ejaaz:
shtick, please reach out. We would love to hear from you.

Josh:
Awesome, yeah, well, on that note, thank you guys so much for watching and we'll

Josh:
catch you guys next week.

Ejaaz:
See you guys.